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	<title>Comments on: SA Greens choosing their next state MP</title>
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	<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880</link>
	<description>Elections and politics in Australia and around the world.</description>
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		<title>By: Brenton</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-2#comment-21862</link>
		<dc:creator>Brenton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jul 2010 01:42:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-21862</guid>
		<description>Ben, obviously you will tell that to the Party Leader as well the next time you see Bob!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben, obviously you will tell that to the Party Leader as well the next time you see Bob!</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Raue</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-21796</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Raue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jul 2010 12:16:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-21796</guid>
		<description>Thank you Brenton, you can piss off now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Brenton, you can piss off now.</p>
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		<title>By: Brenton</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-21791</link>
		<dc:creator>Brenton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jul 2010 10:12:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-21791</guid>
		<description>Unlike the &#039;noise&#039; of Ms L. R. in NSW , we have 2 fabulous Green MPs here in SA.!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unlike the &#8216;noise&#8217; of Ms L. R. in NSW , we have 2 fabulous Green MPs here in SA.!</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Lea</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-21734</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Lea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jul 2010 10:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-21734</guid>
		<description>Actually Simon, I believe the Hitchhiker&#039;s Guide to the Galaxy was describing the planet Earth as &quot;Mostly Harmless&quot;, I am quite sure that Douglas Adams had no such delusions about humans!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually Simon, I believe the Hitchhiker&#8217;s Guide to the Galaxy was describing the planet Earth as &#8220;Mostly Harmless&#8221;, I am quite sure that Douglas Adams had no such delusions about humans!</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Jones</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-13897</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 02:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-13897</guid>
		<description>If anyone would like to actually know more they can contact me on 0400 294 918 or by email at simon.jones2010@sa.greens.org.au and find out just how &quot;typical&quot; I am.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If anyone would like to actually know more they can contact me on 0400 294 918 or by email at <a href="mailto:simon.jones2010@sa.greens.org.au">simon.jones2010@sa.greens.org.au</a> and find out just how &#8220;typical&#8221; I am.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Jones</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-13896</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 02:49:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-13896</guid>
		<description>I had to laugh at the &quot;typical hills based Green&quot; comment. It reminded me of another Simon Jones who played Arthur Dent in the Hitchhikers Guide where humans were described as &quot;mostly harmless&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had to laugh at the &#8220;typical hills based Green&#8221; comment. It reminded me of another Simon Jones who played Arthur Dent in the Hitchhikers Guide where humans were described as &#8220;mostly harmless&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Salmon</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-12966</link>
		<dc:creator>Salmon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 01:02:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-12966</guid>
		<description>Deconst, you write:
&quot;“Grassroots” means convincing others from the roots, not from the leaves.&quot;

This is not the way our modern mass media society works. Grassroots political activism doesn&#039;t work on a large scale and with a society which is disengaged from the political process.

Getting a green onto Sunrise every week to chat about pointless crap in a light and airy way with Mel and Kochie will do more for the greens overnight than every greens member with their &quot;grassroots&quot; activism does for the greens in a lifetime.

This is just a fact, unpleasant as it may be. And the greens must start to deal with the world as it is, not as how they wish it might be.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Deconst, you write:<br />
&#8220;“Grassroots” means convincing others from the roots, not from the leaves.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is not the way our modern mass media society works. Grassroots political activism doesn&#8217;t work on a large scale and with a society which is disengaged from the political process.</p>
<p>Getting a green onto Sunrise every week to chat about pointless crap in a light and airy way with Mel and Kochie will do more for the greens overnight than every greens member with their &#8220;grassroots&#8221; activism does for the greens in a lifetime.</p>
<p>This is just a fact, unpleasant as it may be. And the greens must start to deal with the world as it is, not as how they wish it might be.</p>
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		<title>By: deconst</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-12933</link>
		<dc:creator>deconst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 22:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-12933</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s not the representatives of the Greens that are the reason that the Greens are not elected into parliament: it&#039;s that the Greens platform is difficult to swallow for the general public because it offers a real alternative and that, frankly, is scary. The major parties share platforms far more than at any other time of political history.

&quot;Left-wing wankiness&quot; is just a matter of perception. I&#039;ve got a demotivator calendar and one of the maxims is: &quot;The downside of being better than everyone else is that people tend to assume you&#039;re pretentious.&quot; It&#039;s difficult being right because it really gets on peoples&#039; nerves. Rather than exclaiming how right we are, we&#039;re better off just keeping our heads down and working for change, one voter at a time. Ignore ideologues&#039; claims that the Greens are &#039;kooky&#039; and &#039;weird&#039; - they really want to sell you something, so instead point out how shortsighted and self-serving their own message is.

Preselecting the right people is not the key to convince people that the Greens are normal. That&#039;s up to the members of the Greens to do, by being responsible, solid citizens of the community themselves. &quot;Grassroots&quot; means convincing others from the roots, not from the leaves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not the representatives of the Greens that are the reason that the Greens are not elected into parliament: it&#8217;s that the Greens platform is difficult to swallow for the general public because it offers a real alternative and that, frankly, is scary. The major parties share platforms far more than at any other time of political history.</p>
<p>&#8220;Left-wing wankiness&#8221; is just a matter of perception. I&#8217;ve got a demotivator calendar and one of the maxims is: &#8220;The downside of being better than everyone else is that people tend to assume you&#8217;re pretentious.&#8221; It&#8217;s difficult being right because it really gets on peoples&#8217; nerves. Rather than exclaiming how right we are, we&#8217;re better off just keeping our heads down and working for change, one voter at a time. Ignore ideologues&#8217; claims that the Greens are &#8216;kooky&#8217; and &#8216;weird&#8217; &#8211; they really want to sell you something, so instead point out how shortsighted and self-serving their own message is.</p>
<p>Preselecting the right people is not the key to convince people that the Greens are normal. That&#8217;s up to the members of the Greens to do, by being responsible, solid citizens of the community themselves. &#8220;Grassroots&#8221; means convincing others from the roots, not from the leaves.</p>
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		<title>By: Salmon</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-12841</link>
		<dc:creator>Salmon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 01:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-12841</guid>
		<description>Deconst, I agree with you about the &quot;brand&quot; of the greens being important. The problem is that the Greens aren&#039;t associated primarily by normal voters with &quot;integrity first&quot; rather they are associated with being weird.

And that is the word I hear when I try and talk to people about politics and try to persuade them to vote greens. A few years back John Howard used the word &quot;kooky&quot; to describe the greens - quite rich coming from Uncle Fester himself you might say - but it resonated with normal voters because in their minds that is the image they have of the greens. Weird, kooky, living on another planet.

This is the greens brand for the 90% of the electorate which will not vote for us. Not because the greens chose it and not because it&#039;s neccesarily accurate or fair, but because that&#039;s how things have worked out. Even ordinarily decent and fair journalists can&#039;t write about the greens without a titter or some reference to tofu or mung beans. You might say this is the journalists problem - and their fault - and this is true, but it doesn&#039;t change anything for us. The media is what it is, and it is up to the greens to change their approach and change their image, otherwise, as I said before, they will get nowhere.

Preselecting the right people is key to this. What we need is people who are able to come across as being normal. Kerry Nettle and Lee Rhiannon do not come across as normal. Anyone who thinks they do needs to expand their social circle and start mixing with ordinary people. People like Kerry Nettle and Lee Rhiannon make ordinary voters roll their eyes. And in many respects I don&#039;t blame them. I struggle not to roll my eyes myself when I see them on TV, and I always vote green.

As for the idea of having both a male and female leader, this is NOT a good idea. Because it plays into the negative stereotypes of the greens which they need to dispel. It makes the greens look (yes) weird and slaves to political correctness, affirmative action, and all the left-wing wankiness which is associated with those things.

Wankiness, this is another word associated with the greens. Kooky, weird and wanky. Too much &quot;save the gay whales&quot; and not enough focus on bread and butter issues that matter to normal voters - which incidentally, are issues on which the progressive left actually has a lot to say.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Deconst, I agree with you about the &#8220;brand&#8221; of the greens being important. The problem is that the Greens aren&#8217;t associated primarily by normal voters with &#8220;integrity first&#8221; rather they are associated with being weird.</p>
<p>And that is the word I hear when I try and talk to people about politics and try to persuade them to vote greens. A few years back John Howard used the word &#8220;kooky&#8221; to describe the greens &#8211; quite rich coming from Uncle Fester himself you might say &#8211; but it resonated with normal voters because in their minds that is the image they have of the greens. Weird, kooky, living on another planet.</p>
<p>This is the greens brand for the 90% of the electorate which will not vote for us. Not because the greens chose it and not because it&#8217;s neccesarily accurate or fair, but because that&#8217;s how things have worked out. Even ordinarily decent and fair journalists can&#8217;t write about the greens without a titter or some reference to tofu or mung beans. You might say this is the journalists problem &#8211; and their fault &#8211; and this is true, but it doesn&#8217;t change anything for us. The media is what it is, and it is up to the greens to change their approach and change their image, otherwise, as I said before, they will get nowhere.</p>
<p>Preselecting the right people is key to this. What we need is people who are able to come across as being normal. Kerry Nettle and Lee Rhiannon do not come across as normal. Anyone who thinks they do needs to expand their social circle and start mixing with ordinary people. People like Kerry Nettle and Lee Rhiannon make ordinary voters roll their eyes. And in many respects I don&#8217;t blame them. I struggle not to roll my eyes myself when I see them on TV, and I always vote green.</p>
<p>As for the idea of having both a male and female leader, this is NOT a good idea. Because it plays into the negative stereotypes of the greens which they need to dispel. It makes the greens look (yes) weird and slaves to political correctness, affirmative action, and all the left-wing wankiness which is associated with those things.</p>
<p>Wankiness, this is another word associated with the greens. Kooky, weird and wanky. Too much &#8220;save the gay whales&#8221; and not enough focus on bread and butter issues that matter to normal voters &#8211; which incidentally, are issues on which the progressive left actually has a lot to say.</p>
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		<title>By: deconst</title>
		<link>http://www.tallyroom.com.au/1880/comment-page-1#comment-12825</link>
		<dc:creator>deconst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jan 2010 12:40:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tallyroom.com.au/?p=1880#comment-12825</guid>
		<description>You ask first for people who are &quot;media performers&quot; then for people who are &quot;normal people&quot;. More often than not those are mutually exclusive.

It&#039;s hard to argue that any people who are willing to immerse themselves in the cauldron that is political life are &quot;normal people&quot;. I believe most people - normal people - don&#039;t give two hoots about the people in politics. Names don&#039;t matter as much as they used to in today&#039;s soundbite age: rather, it&#039;s brands. &quot;Normal&quot; in politics is more about image management than being someone one would have a beer with.

One can prognosticate about the formula for a party to gain power but I would not be happy to be part of - or vote for - a party who is willing to compromise their core principles to that end. That is the Green brand: integrity first. It&#039;s a tough sell because the public trust of politicians is regrettably so low that &quot;politics with integrity&quot; seems almost paradoxical, but the Greens are directly fighting that.

I guess that&#039;s why it&#039;s so hard to represent the Greens: one has to show integrity, and it appears Paul Petit did not sufficiently demonstrate that to the Greens SA council.

Integrity and &quot;image management&quot; more often than not don&#039;t go hand-in-hand, unfortunately. It doesn&#039;t mean that a talented political support team can&#039;t deliver on both fronts, however, and that&#039;s what I believe the federal Greens are trying to build.

As for &quot;leader&quot; of the party - did some research on the NZ Greens after your mention of a Rasta MP and learned they have a female and a male co-leader. I like that idea. The retirement of Bob Brown may see something like that come to pass: Christine Milne and Scott Ludlam, perhaps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You ask first for people who are &#8220;media performers&#8221; then for people who are &#8220;normal people&#8221;. More often than not those are mutually exclusive.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s hard to argue that any people who are willing to immerse themselves in the cauldron that is political life are &#8220;normal people&#8221;. I believe most people &#8211; normal people &#8211; don&#8217;t give two hoots about the people in politics. Names don&#8217;t matter as much as they used to in today&#8217;s soundbite age: rather, it&#8217;s brands. &#8220;Normal&#8221; in politics is more about image management than being someone one would have a beer with.</p>
<p>One can prognosticate about the formula for a party to gain power but I would not be happy to be part of &#8211; or vote for &#8211; a party who is willing to compromise their core principles to that end. That is the Green brand: integrity first. It&#8217;s a tough sell because the public trust of politicians is regrettably so low that &#8220;politics with integrity&#8221; seems almost paradoxical, but the Greens are directly fighting that.</p>
<p>I guess that&#8217;s why it&#8217;s so hard to represent the Greens: one has to show integrity, and it appears Paul Petit did not sufficiently demonstrate that to the Greens SA council.</p>
<p>Integrity and &#8220;image management&#8221; more often than not don&#8217;t go hand-in-hand, unfortunately. It doesn&#8217;t mean that a talented political support team can&#8217;t deliver on both fronts, however, and that&#8217;s what I believe the federal Greens are trying to build.</p>
<p>As for &#8220;leader&#8221; of the party &#8211; did some research on the NZ Greens after your mention of a Rasta MP and learned they have a female and a male co-leader. I like that idea. The retirement of Bob Brown may see something like that come to pass: Christine Milne and Scott Ludlam, perhaps.</p>
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